Sugarrae - Never Mess With a Woman Who Can Pull Rank

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So, it would seem Andrew Goodman didn’t like my latest rant about SEO as a popularity contest. Normally, I ignore this type of stuff as everyone is entitled to their own opinion. But, when my words get twisted into comments I don’t even recognize (such as saying I respect a guy who is spamming restaurant review sites), I’m gonna sound the hell back.

So, in all honesty, the rest of this post is speaking directly to Andrew Goodman…

1. Happy birthday :)

2. You said…

“Rae’s point seems to be that if you don’t have something called “SEO chops” or “social media spamming chops” or whatever it is, then you’re just an unskilled loser”

And yes, that it was I said, but it was directed at those who were upset they couldn’t market themselves (not websites containing information) by getting *their* submissions Sphunn and *their* pictures next to the stories making it to the whats hot homepage.

It was not a statement that if you didn’t market yourself on Sphinn you were a “loser” - it was me saying that if you want glorification for *being* a top Sphinn “face” or any form of “SEOlebirty” for that matter, if you can’t market *yourself* enough to obtain it, *if* that is what your goal is, then you probably don’t have marketing skills *worth* being known for. And I stand by that statement armed with a bat to defend it. ;-)

3. You said…

“But I’m not trying to get my mug to the top of Sphinn. I’m trying to get customers to buy drills, travel, lightbulbs, enterprise software, and… you know… products and services.”

I’d have to ask you to re-read my post. I specifically said there were people who were *great* marketers who couldn’t give two craps about building a “Sphinn celebrity status” or an SEOlebrity status. And more power to them. Many of my friends are in that category. And the massive whole of my business resides in that *same* category. My post was not aimed at Sphinn *users* - it was aimed at those whining that they couldn’t get *their* works or submissions noticed.

I’d venture to say if you can’t get your drill site, travel site, enterprise software site, et al noticed, then you wouldn’t be much of an SEO. Whining about not being able to achieve celeb status in the seo sphere, *if* that is your goal is no different to me than whining about how you can’t rank for power drills. Compete or find a new venture.

4. You said…

“Like Mike Grehan, I’m hopefully in business because there’s more to life than a thin concept of what some consider to be “SEO chops” — for example, the real-life corporate marketing”

First, I adore Mike, so he had to get a link. Second, I respectfully ask before you read one post of mine and make an assumption on my overall theories of what it takes to be successful in SEO that you take the time to read some other stuff I’ve written. I have no doubt been one of the louder voices in the industry discussing how marketing is marketing.

Well over a year ago I was trying to get people to realize link development was merely traffic development also known as straight marketing and I’ve long been building sites that aim to market and survive the coming evolution.

Better yet, refer to your memory as you and I specifically exchanged an email conversation in regards to my speaking slot at Toronto SES (which I later had to cancel out on due to uncontrollable circumstances) and what I planned to cover where I said, and I quote; “[listing of more traditional marketing meet web marketing methods I was going to cover] and a few of the things from my presentation from last year, which was link development versus traffic development and how search engine optimizers by default have to become straight marketers online in addition to SEO’s to obtain their end goal – links.”

5. You said…

“I didn’t know anyone with a full-time job who really partook of the exercise.”

Come on Andrew, some of the best guys in SEO whore, long story have the process down to a science - and you’re right, most don’t have full time “jobs” - they’re running the businesses that employ those with the full time jobs.

6. You said…

“I mean it’s not exactly like Joe Rutabaga, a genuine consumer of media to be used for building his retail business just sort of stumbled across Jill’s article”

That’s because Sphinn is aimed at search engine marketers. It’s isn’t aimed at Joe Pool guy looking to optimize his pool service website. It is aimed at professional search marketers… a talented SEO *is* the Joe consumer here. “Newbies” or people outside the SEO sphere have no reason to be reading a site that is grouping the top (perceived) SEO stories in the industry day in and day out. He needs information on how to market his local small business site or other information aimed at a single retailer.

7. You said…

“Hey Rae, sorry I just whined about the guy spamming the restaurant site, but nope, I don’t respect his “chops”.”

Come on Andrew, you know damn well that isn’t what I was referring to. But, I will say this, as I’ve been saying it for years (see message by chrisnrae, my old username) - bitching about the guy ahead of you does nothing - your time is best spent figuring out a way to get ahead of him.

8. You said…

“How in the sophomoric world o’ Digg”

And I got the feeling you were referring to me as “sophomoric” of search engine marketing. Again, I’d ask you to look into me a little further. My “public” voice isn’t old, but my face to those in this industry and marketing skills are… I’ve been playing on this playground for a lot longer than I’ve been advising other people how to do so. I was here before pagerank, when Yahoo was only a directory site and long before the age of social media. Don’t assume because I don’t resent social media marketing that I must be one of those “newfangled kids” on the block.

Edited to add: Since I wrote this last night, the original post Andrew made seems to have been deleted. *Shrug* For now, you can still find it cached in Google.